Bad motor numbers

Identifaction of VIN, case numbers and cylinder heads
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caschnd1
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Bad motor numbers

#1

Post by caschnd1 »

The number is reported to be 49FL9018. The first "9" looks ok to me. The second "9" with the curved tail doesn't look right. My understanding is that Harley never used a "9" stamp with a curved tail. In fact when I was getting my bike titled in Arizona that was something the DMV inspector told me they look for. The "9" and "6" are supposed to have straight tails. He showed me a book that the AZ DMV uses that showed detailed photos of each stamp from "0" to "9". Anyone else see this as suspicious? Just curious.

-Craig



03Roadking
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#2

Post by 03Roadking »

My question is what is the mark to the right of the 8 looks like a P. from the information I gathered they didn't use a 9 they used the 6 and turned it around for a 9 but I am far far from an expert I am sure the one's who have been around a lot longer will comment

57pan
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#3

Post by 57pan »

I agree - it just doesn't look right. I just compared it to the picture I have of my motor number and I think the 0 is different too. The eBay 0 looks more round than mine.

The guy has good feedback numbers though.

Cotten
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#4

Post by Cotten »

Yes the numbers look like a mess.

As if "cylinders re-sleeved standard bore, heads rebuilt with lead-free seats, etc." weren't enough to scare anyone away, even without the cracked case!

"P" after the VIN indicates a 'package truck' or hack machine, and would have had a springer fork,...but the P would have been off the number pad to the right.

I'd sell the damn thing too, except as a licensed dealer, I might face a fine or jail time. 9's?

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Re: Bad motor numbers

#5

Post by FlatHeadSix »

I just took a closer look at my stampings, the 9's on the 49FL have no tail, the 9's on the 47WL look like upside down 6's (tails). I'd really like to see that DOT reference book the guy in Arizona has to find out what the factory was using. Its pretty obvious that all those old numbers were hand stamped, I'm guessing that it was pretty much up to the guy that was doing the stamping. Shift work is a bitch (excuse me) but I'll almost bet that it depended on the day of the week and the time of day as to how those number turned out.

just my opinion (for whatever its worth)
later,
mike

caschnd1
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#6

Post by caschnd1 »

Yeah, I wish I had a copy of that book for my own use. Unfortunately it belonged to the DMV and I'm sure they aren't willing to part with it.

The thing that the DMV guy pointed out to me was that they look for 9's or 6's with curved tails. He said that the tails should always be straight for both numbers. But we were talking only about FL's and not about WL's. I don't know if those were built in the same location or on the same assembly line, so maybe they had different stamps. The book might have had a whole different secton with different pictures for WL numbers.

The numbers on this bike might be totally legit. Maybe there were other cracks in the cases that had been repaired and then the numbers were restamped. I just though they looked curious.

-Craig

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Re: Bad motor numbers

#7

Post by Cotten »

Illinois uses Palmer's to reference the stamp conformities. (I know because I first sold it to the investigators!)

Any defacing of the VIN is still a felony by the strictest letter of the law. With a proper paper trail, a repaired VIN could be accomplished, but it would be tragic,...no...stupid to use the wrong stamps!

Guest

Re: Bad motor numbers

#8

Post by Guest »

Post by knucklefrank on Jul 23, 2005, 1:39pm

i had a 68 flh and the year 6 was straight and the 6 in the sequence number was curved, the belly 6 was also curved, also this the same on a 69 xlh, palmer states there was dual use

rigidpanman
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#9

Post by rigidpanman »

if its a 49,the last four digits must be an odd number.for example,49fl6331.

caschnd1
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#10

Post by caschnd1 »

Harley used the odd/even numbering system from 1962 thru 1969 (althought I found another publication that says 1960 thru 1969). In that case if the year was odd, the first digit of a four digit sequential production number was odd, or even if the year is even. If the sequential production number is five digits long, the first two will be even in even years, and on in odd years.

Example: 64FL2001 good
Example: 67FLH15001 good
Example: 64FL3001 bad

This even/odd rule did not apply to 1948 thru 1961 (or maybe 1959?) models.

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Re: Bad motor numbers

#11

Post by BigMike »

under the "9018" it looks like dremel marks, and to the left of the 9 in "9018" there appears to be a shadow of a 6. Looks like a case I wouldn't want to have checked by the DMV here in FL.

rigidpanman
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#12

Post by rigidpanman »

cash,not sure about the 61 and up,but up to that point or so,they must be even numbers for even years and odd for odd years ie,for my 49 it must be something like six thousand three hundred and thirty one.

caschnd1
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#13

Post by caschnd1 »

I consulted two different books about it last night and both said that there were no even/odd rules for numbers on pans prior to 1960 (one book) or 1962 (the other book). My '49 pan has an even number (5 digit) which has never been called into question when registering it. Palmers was one of the books I consulted, and I understand they are used by some state DMV as an authority on valid numbers.

Maybe some of the guys who do restorations for a living can give their input. I'm only going on what I've read and my own motor numbers.

Guest

Re: Bad motor numbers

#14

Post by Guest »

I understand that '48-'61 had no specific sequence. This is from all the books that I have read. Also, my '48FL has a four digit vin #, and it starts with an odd number followed by 2 more odd numbers and then it is finished with an even number. I didn't have any issues with my state, nor did the previous owner. It is only from '62 and up when HD started sequential numbering.

rigidpanman
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Re: Bad motor numbers

#15

Post by rigidpanman »

guest,you are correct your 48 should end with an even number just as my 49 end with an odd number.dont know how accurate it is but my info came out of the what fits what guide from about 20 years ago.

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