belly number pictures?

Identifaction of VIN, case numbers and cylinder heads
Speeding Big Twin
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Re: belly number pictures?

#16

Post by Speeding Big Twin » Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:41 am

radar, because 2 is the code number for your matching belly numbers the engine may have originally been meant to be an E-series (61 ci) Panhead. But for reasons unknown it ended up being an F-series (74 ci). I've seen that on several occasions and I've seen code number 1 appear on some E-series engines.

The 7s stamped on the top rear of Panhead cases are consistent with an F-series engine.

Regarding your VIN, in June you stated: "the original vin number was ground off. the state stamped over in the same spot it used to be." But now you're saying: "also some of the original vin is visible. It says 49Fl.... the rest is unreadable."

Can you post a photo showing those four characters: 49FL. I'd like to see if they were applied using factory stamps.

Anyway, you mentioned previously that Wisconsin stamped a state number on both case halves and you have a clear title in said state with those numbers on it so it sounds like you're okay in that department. Eric



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Re: belly number pictures?

#17

Post by Cotten » Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:34 pm

You will be OK in Wisconsin, that is.

....Cotten

radarv
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Re: belly number pictures?

#18

Post by radarv » Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:46 pm

eric, I will try to post a pic of thr vin when I get a chance. as far as my earlier post. I looked closer at the vin boss & found the other numbers. if I look at an angle you can see the first ,third ,fouth numbers.there is not much there. we will see if the camera will pic it up. but we will try. I'll have to do it when I get home from work. cotten, thats what I was kind of wondering. I suppose if I have to I may look for another set of correct cases. I really dont want any trouble with the law if I was to ride it out of state. I will post pics latter tonite. thanks guys, radar

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Re: belly number pictures?

#19

Post by mbskeam » Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:56 pm

You will be OK in Wisconsin, that is.
just asking......
don't the other states honor other DMV/state patrol/inspections.
IE: state produced Vin's, that are given to said veh?
don't this fall under the interstate compacts...sharing of info, wants/warrents, veh. registrations, drivers licenses...etc

my point is, if WA state patrol says my Vin's,(green tagged) are good then what right does a different state have to say other wise....

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Re: belly number pictures?

#20

Post by kevsett » Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:12 pm

During the 90's and since I became aware of VIN police at the national rides (Sturgis, Daytona, etc.) and heard several stories of immediate confiscation and lockdown of bikes with "bad" numbers, etc. I'm not a direct recipient of this kind of treatment so technically it is still only hearsay on my part; but I believe it to be true. But I also believe in Bigfoot and 2012!!!!!
mbskeam wrote:
You will be OK in Wisconsin, that is.
just asking......
don't the other states honor other DMV/state patrol/inspections.
IE: state produced Vin's, that are given to said veh?
don't this fall under the interstate compacts...sharing of info, wants/warrents, veh. registrations, drivers licenses...etc

my point is, if WA state patrol says my Vin's,(green tagged) are good then what right does a different state have to say other wise....

john HD
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Re: belly number pictures?

#21

Post by john HD » Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:44 pm

i'd be curious to know who at the wisdot did the "stamping" ?

as long as i have lived here i have never heard of a state employee that got out behind a desk, let alone with a hammer and a set of state sanctioned stamps.

i have heard of state patrol officers doing "inspections" for out of state vehicles from non title states...

and i agree, if wisconsin says it is ok you should be good to go.... anywhere.

john

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Re: belly number pictures?

#22

Post by radarv » Tue Jan 05, 2010 9:35 am

here is the best pic I could get with my cheap digital camera. john, I assume dot or dot enforcement stamped the new vin. years ago here in the state I saw a sporty with a wis stamp on both case halves like mine .I gather it also was a "special construction" bike with out the original vin. I'm going to ask a local custom bike builder who stamps his bikes. I'll let you guys know what I find out. eric, what I see of the old vin I get 4,?,fl,?,4,0 or 9,7. the belly #s match on both case halves 249-12157. radar
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Re: belly number pictures?

#23

Post by john HD » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:21 pm

radar,

see if your camera has a macro setting give it a try.

john

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Re: belly number pictures?

#24

Post by Speeding Big Twin » Tue Jan 05, 2010 4:27 pm

Thanks for the photo, radar, and another one would be good if possible. It looks like there's a second, lightly stamped S at the end?

Here's part of a 49 FL serial number for comparison with yours:
Panhead.jpg
And a belly number. But it's from a different engine. Notice it starts with 2 but its serial number, of which I also have a photo, is an FL. Eric
249-12Copy.jpg
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old52pan
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Re: belly number pictures?

#25

Post by old52pan » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:00 pm

Radar, with all due respect,that has to be one of the worst stamp/scribe jobs I have ever seen. The vin pad looks as if it was either given the acid treatment or rewelded some time ago. John,maybe this was the work of some DMV female employee with an electric scriber who was late for lunch break :lol:
Sure doesn't say much for the wisconsin department of motor vehicles now does it? tim

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Re: belly number pictures?

#26

Post by radarv » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:50 pm

john, I will give it a try. I'm not to good with digital technology. I was laying on a very cold floor holding a flashlight & camera trying to take the picture at 1am. eric, the belly #s look like mine. the vin looks similar to what is slightly visible on mine. there is a "double S" stamped on there. old 52 pan, it wasnt acid etched. It was a real bad grind off . I assume when it was restamped. I dont think you may be far from the truth there though. radar

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Re: belly number pictures?

#27

Post by Bosheff » Wed Jan 06, 2010 1:47 pm

To Speeding Big Twin: The # boss on the pic you posted looks kinda funky to me. Looks like it's been resurfaced. An unmolested # boss is not perfectly flat or square on the edges or corners as your photo depicts. They are somewhat radiused and more gently flowing in my opinion. The top of the boss is also very wavy, leading me to believe it has been tampered with. Just my opinion....bosheff

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Re: belly number pictures?

#28

Post by Speeding Big Twin » Thu Jan 07, 2010 7:55 am

Bosheff, the photo I posted is consistent with some other 1949 Panhead examples I have. I don’t think the boss has been altered and the two below appear similar to the one I posted:
1949Panhead.jpg
1949Panhead2.jpg
But not all number bosses are the same as each other and maybe the next one shows what you were getting at as far as edges are concerned, particularly at the right-hand end of the boss:
1949Panhead3.jpg
You also mentioned the top of the boss was very wavy and here’s one which could be described in a similar fashion. But I don’t think the boss has been altered. Eric
1949Panhead4.jpg
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Re: belly number pictures?

#29

Post by Cotten » Thu Jan 07, 2010 2:38 pm

A valid title in one State should logically be accepted in another, but that would require a perfect World.

Even carrying your paper will not prevent impounding if a local officer feels like it, whether is just Barney Fife Syndrome, or intentions more sinister. Any variance from standard VIN conformity justifys detaining you and your hardware. He doesn't care if it takes you months and legal fees to win it back.

In Illinois, a Georgia or Nevada title is a red flag to the bureaucratic desk-nazis, even with a pristine VIN.
Illinois' State enforcement arm, however, mellowed considerably after over-zealous impounds caused a clash with ABATE. The Secretary of State issued new guidelines for length of impoundment without charges as a result. So the State Police only want perpetrators, not victims.
But the S.O.S. paper-shufflers are turning a cascade of victims into perpetrators: One fellow with a perfect VIN tried an out-of-state title mill, and was notified that he attempted mail fraud, and that his machine can never be titled in Illinois by that VIN.

The times are a changin',

....Cotten

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Re: belly number pictures?

#30

Post by Ohio-Rider » Thu Jan 07, 2010 7:49 pm

I'll say it again. A title does not mean that a motorcycle isn't stolen. It only means that the number stamped on it has not been reported stolen. The state of Pennsylvania will title anything you got. No questions asked. Be very careful not to post photo's of your VIN on the internet fella's, there are a lot of bad people out there. -Steve

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