How to start my '59 Pan ??

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hjans
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How to start my '59 Pan ??

#1

Post by hjans » Tue Apr 08, 2008 4:02 pm

Hi there

I wanted to drive out on my freshly earned Pan yesterday. Never drove a Pan before ( just the test-ride, and then the engine was hot and started easy). Previously just had a couple of Shovel's.
But it took me 30 minutes to start the engine !
And it looked so easy !!
I read a post here how to start , but i do not find it anymore.
Can anyone help me and explain the right way to start ?
There's that thing with the timer advance/delay, the thing with the carb, the thing with pre-fill the cylinders etc. etc.

Thanks

Hope my quote down here turnes to be the truth !!

H ( feeling real stupid now !!)



57pan
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#2

Post by 57pan » Tue Apr 08, 2008 5:05 pm

There are lots of techiques out there but ultimately it comes down to what works best for your particular bike. And it will take you a while to get to know your bike and all her moods and idiocyncracies.

Then, of course, there are so many variables that it is impossible to account for all the variations: outside air temp, motor temp, type of carburetor, type of ignition (auto/manual advance). Each combination of variables may require slight modifications in your technique. But, one thing that you absolutely, positively MUST ensure is that there are no leaks in your intake manifold connections.

I have a basically stock motor but with a CV carb and Mallory ignition and my technique for starting a cold motor is:
enrichener on
twist the throttle 3 times and hold it open
with ignition off, kick it three times
close throttle and leave it closed, turn ignition on
usually starts in 2 - 4 kicks

That's just me and my bike though... it may work different for you.

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#3

Post by steve_wood » Tue Apr 08, 2008 5:44 pm

Hjans:

At the risk of telling you something you already know....

Cold start:

1. Fuel on
2. Ignition off
3. Choke full (or almost, depends on weather)
4. Throttle wide open
5. Move kickstart to the point where compression begins
6. Allow kickstart spring to return it to top
*** 5 and 6 are important - otherwise you are wasting energy
7. 2 or 3 solid kicks - don't jump on it, just firm and follow through
8. Retard spark fully
9. Ignition ON
10. Throttle closed or open just a crack (depends on a lot of things)
11. Choke 1/4 or 1/2 (you will have to find right setting)
12. Firm kicks

When it starts, fully advance spark!

If that doesn't work and you suspect it's flooded:

1. Choke off
2. Throttle wide open
3. Kick it through several times (carefull - it might start!)
4. Try steps 1 through 12 again

Hot start:

1. Fuel on
2. Ignition on
3. Choke 1/4 or off (depends on weather)
4. Throttle closed or slightly open (you'll need to figure it out)
5. Retard spark
5. Move kickstart to the point where compression begins
6. Allow kickstart spring to return it to top
7. Firm kicks

Hope this helps !

steve

hjans
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#4

Post by hjans » Tue Apr 08, 2008 7:05 pm

To Panhead : Zuid-Limburg

57Pan and Steve-wood : thanks guys, going to practice on this one. I've got a lot to learn, these old bikes sure aren't what i used to drive. But i'm not afraid that eventually i'l ger there. Just takes some time and probably some good swearing.
And do not be afraid : on this one i'm fresh as a baby.

again : thanks

john HD
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#5

Post by john HD » Tue Apr 08, 2008 11:45 pm

H

well at least you got it started!

here is what i know after many years of pan ownership.

if it doesn't start after 4 or 5 kicks something is wrong. if you are building up a sweat kicking look at the easy stuff first.

the gas is on and the battery has a good charge.

you have gas.

you have reasonably clean spark plugs. tan not oily black. it is amazing how well they start with a fresh set. do yourself a favor and get 4 or 5 sets of extra plugs until you get the sequence of starting your bike sorted out.

check your points and condensor if the above do not solve your problem.

lastly check to make sure you do not have a leak at the manifold, if the bike is sucking air behind the carb the mixture will not be correct. there is loads of info here on how to find and fix this problem.

the actual act of kicking your bike over is a learned skill and takes practice, there are about 1000 different ways of doing it and the advice given above is a good guide.

john

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#6

Post by FlatHeadSix » Wed Apr 09, 2008 12:05 am

Hjans

Do you live on a hill?, most panhead owners purchase a home at the top of a steep hill so they can coast down and start their bikes.

JUST KIDDING!, although it does work sometimes.

Listen to all the advice above and I'll add one more item to the list. It will sometimes make a difference if you kick the bike while straddling it or kicking it from the side while it is leaning over on the jiffy stand. A bike that leans way over on the side stand has the carburetor aimed down towards the intake manifold, any extra liquid fuel in the carb runs straight into the engine. If the bike is standing level it is better for 2 reasons; the float is positioned properly and should not allow extra fuel to enter the float chamber or reach too high a level on the emulsion tube, and any extra fuel will run out the choke end of the carb and exit through the air cleaner instead of flooding the engine. Try it both ways and see if it makes a difference.

I've always thought that the flatheads were easier to start sometimes because the carb is on the opposite side of the engine and points downhill when the bike is on the side stand.

mike

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#7

Post by Panacea » Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:42 am

I never thought of that, I think I'll try it upright, seems like mine floods easy when it's hot....

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#8

Post by BigMike » Wed Apr 09, 2008 4:42 am

1. Fuel on, ignition off
2. Choke on, Kick twice
3. retard timing, choke open
4. without touching throttle, 1 firm solid kick... when bike starts, slowly advance timing to almost full advance
5. ease into throttle to bring just above idle
once engine is running smooth, advance timing all the way, release throttle back to idle

That worked most of the time for my 64 with the Linkert or Keihin, if it didn't fire up at step 4, wait, and start over at step #3. If you flood it, have a smoke and wait a while.

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#9

Post by Cotten » Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:44 pm

For easier starting, make sure a crowd isn't watching.

....Cotten

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#10

Post by FlatHeadSix » Wed Apr 09, 2008 3:12 pm

Exactly right Cotten, the number of kicks required is directly proportional to the number of people watching. More people=more kicks!

mike

john HD
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#11

Post by john HD » Wed Apr 09, 2008 10:29 pm

amen to that cotten/mike!

john

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#12

Post by mogman » Thu Apr 10, 2008 3:34 am

Last weekend my Pan started giving me mucho grief, turned into 2-3 ciggy puffs per start, I rode down to a bar in Corpus Christi named Knuckle heads Ha I had one woman ask why I had pedals on my motorcycle (she was only looking at the right side) I had one tattooed bearded "biker" ask if it was a Shovel head. Fortunately when it was time to leave it was kind enough to start on the first "ing on" kick. long story short I found the carb flange bolts were loose!!(thanks guys for the advice)
hjans good luck with your Pan I'm sure you'll get it right!!
Craig

PS My motor cases came from the Netherlands!!

1950Bobber

Kick starting that Pan!

#13

Post by 1950Bobber » Thu Apr 10, 2008 4:47 am

Cotten wrote:For easier starting, make sure a crowd isn't watching.

....Cotten

DITTO (what Cotten says :)

AND....

Never, ...NEVER put your helmet on, or for that matter, your leather jacket UNTIL IT'S STARTED....seems to jinx the process.....or....she's just goin' to show you not to be so cocky!!!!!

Good luck.

Jim in Seattle (1950 Bobber, that's NOW a chopper!)

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#14

Post by RussW » Fri Apr 11, 2008 1:16 pm

From the Feb, 1952 issue of Cycle magazine. Guess its been the subject of discussion for a long time...
kicker.jpg
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#15

Post by Cotten » Fri Apr 11, 2008 2:19 pm

I apologize for hijacking this thread, but since I already have...

Has anyone witnessed someone starting their machine by priming it, bring it up to the compression stroke/firing point, clicked on the ignion, and then advancing the spark to make it pop over? Or by opening the points with a screwdriver... on purpose?

....Cotten

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