The Panhead & Flathead Site

Author: jd

I've got a line on a 57 pan original uncut frame. Looks I would rate it at "good " not great and not excellent. It runs good (I havn't heard it though) but (from what the owner said) just started to leak oil out of the chain oiler when the bike is not even running. He had someone put a new oil pump on and it still leaks. It will drain the tank dry just flow right out. The bike is freeking awesome in my book and he said the lowest he would go is 7000.00. My question to you guys is ...Is it worth the chance that it's not something major? It even has the rear bike stand still on it. original tanks with shifter.

Post by cotten

JD!

"Sumping" is a minor, although irritating, fact of life. But there is a very simple way to deal with it, should you make it your own.
The leakage has little or no bearing upon the value of the machine. Hopefully, it just means oil was recently added!
Please consider only what it is worth to you.

Sounds exciting.

...Cotten

Post by JD

My fear is getting ripped off and finding out nothing is any where near original or near the era. But it does look to be. Is there anything I should look out for? I did go and look at it before I posted. It has the fork lock but he doesn't have the key. Is there any way to know for sure that it is a 57 frame and motor? I own a 76 shovel so I get lost when the really vintage Harley talk comes out but I love them though.

Post by panacea

Take it for a ride if possible! The price doesn't sound to bad, bringing a used-up pan back from the brink of extinction can be costly. The end result is a rare treat. I'm begining to think my 51 resto will take a lot longer than I originally thought, no biggie,i can ride my twinkie...MW

Post by billy

JD-
U asked; "is there any way to know for sure that it is a 57 frame and motor?"

Yes, the motor VIN pad #s will have 57 as the first part then FL or FLH
& then the sequence of build. (for example= 57FLH4973)

As to the frame, it does have *date codes* on the Right side of the top motor mount, Doubtful seller will allow you to remove the gas tank & paint layer(s) to read that code.

Such as D7 D= 4th month 7 = 57 (also should be of course a straight leg rigid frame)

Hope this helps ...

Post by gearbox

I just did a frame up rebuild and have 16,000.00 into it including the $ 8,000.00 I paid for the bike . That included complete motor rebuild and trans, all new bearings ,seals etc. , I painted it my self , first time for me to do any painting and it was done with duplicolor foo foo cans. So if you are ready to put that amount of money and a lot of time , go for it . I know mine was worth it , I stop for gas and people get out and take photos with there cell phones.
I went to the Starkebike fest ( first year , Starke ,fl. )this weekend and some one had a restored (had a S&S carb on it ) 48 and were selling it for 25,000.00.

Post by king

JD

How original the bike should be is related to how you want to use it. If you are looking to show it in an AMCA event then it better be complete but if you want a good rider you can tolerate quite a bit of changes. The best possible scenario would be to have someone who knows Pans to take a look, barring that, if you can get a copy of Bruce Palmers “How to Restore Your Harley Davidson” you will get all the info you need to determine what’s original and what’s not.
Obvious things to check are the “tin”, fenders and tanks. The heads, are they original or after market replacements (STDs), the carburetor and manifold, they should be a Linkert and a rubber band manifold, wheels should be 16” and brakes mechanical.
The most important item to determine is the ownership. How long has the present owner had the bike? Is it registered, inspected, and street legal? Have a good hard look at the title. A 57 Pan has no VIN# like cars and modern Harleys and the credibility of its title rests on the engine # alone. That is the number stamped on the left side of the motor case below the V of the cylinders. Sleeper described the correct numbering sequence and others on this site can help with the shape of the numbers to determine if they are the real thing. Walk away if you are not convinced the bike is clean.
The oil “leak” problem is, as Cotton said, insignificant and an easy fix. But you should hear the bike run and ride it if possible. An engine rebuild will cost about $3k and a transmission probably $1.5k. $7000 in this market it is a good price if the bike is in good-moderate condition and runs well.

Good Luck

King

Post by JD

What is giving me some worry is the numbers on the case arent in the spot it is supposed to be but just lower and to the left of that is a tag that has been tack welded on with some #'s. Which leads me to believe the cases may not be "original". I'm not going to restore it to impecable condition but I want to feel comfortable with the purchase. The heads are the stock type with the normal exhaust mount not the STD three bolt set-up. I'll have him start it up for me before money is exchanged.

Post by kurt

I'd bail on it! If the numbers are screwed with, then you're asking for trouble. I look at bikes this way now.....some may or may not agree, I don't care.......I'll spend good money on a set of cases with a title, or a set of original stamped cases without a title from outside the U.S., then build a bike around them. That is if I was going to use it as a rider and not an AMCA judged bike. fourthgear stated he put $16k into his build, for that money with the quality aftermarket parts (they are out there) you could build a complete bike and still have a lot left over for gas, food, rent, or take your old lady out. I figure you can build a complete, titled H-D, with mostly reproduction parts for around $13k if you can turn a wrench and operate a spray gun.

Just my opinion

Kurt

Post by JD

The #'s may be screwed with but it is titled in Washington state as a 57 FLH. Would that make a difference? Thanks for your .02. And obviously if the #'s arent stamped where they are usually than the cases are not original. Bottom line no exceptions. I apologize for keeping this thread running so ling but I'm on the fence about the purchase. The guy is holding it for me so I have to make a decision today. Some people tell me 7,000. buy it dont even think about it and some say it's just a fair deal. Not good, not great just fair. The motor most likeley has quite a bit of miles on it. I think I'm going to tell him I can't get a truck until tomorrow and I'll investigate the #'s that are on the motor which I'm stupid for not getting yesterday. Thanks everyone...

Post by JD

Also the current owner has owned it for 20 years. Titled and all good. He said he's only put about 5,000 on it because he has alwayse had another bike to ride as a daily rider. Decisions, Decisions...

Post by king

JD

I'm basically with Kurt on this one but I would do one more thing.
I would question the owner as to why the numbers are as they are. There is the possibility that it was "renumbered" legally by the Washington DMV. If I remember there was a post sometime ago that explained such a thing.
But if the explanation is not 100% I would walk --fast! Also it might be good in Wash. but what if you wanted to title it in another state?
Definitely have a listen to it and run it through its gears. A little caution will payoff off big down the line.

King

Post by gearbox

The numbers would really make or break the deal, having bad numbers when you go to an event and have them take for a title check would ( DATONA BIKE WEEK , horror stories ) suck. As far as running and driving , if ya can , its good , but you are going to put some money in it from the way it sounds and I think if I sold my bike I wouldn't let any one ride it unless I knew them real good, let them hear it run and see me ride away , yes but take it for a long ride , I don't think so , they might not come back.

Post by jd on Jun 19, 2006, 7:09pm

Thanks guys I appreciate the info and have definitely taken it to heart. Now I will quit clogging up your message board for the time being..