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Back from hell and trying to assemble my pan project.

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panwars
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 3:40 pm
Bikes: 61FL in a late 49 frame.
59FLH almost stock
Location: Wa state

Back from hell and trying to assemble my pan project.

#1

Post by panwars » Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:01 am

Hi all, it's been about two years I think. I started overhauling my pan and all hell broke loose. Got divorced and went poor.A year after divorce I dated someone and the ex breaks in and shoots up the place, Lucky I was out(for her), she went to jail for a while and I have to still deal with that fun and games. Then the kid gets a vehicular homicide charge and that ate up a year and a half, and the rest of my money. So much stress my health hasn't been great, but the good news is I finally feel together enough to assemble this thing and ride my ass off.

I have run into some questions though and hope you can help me out.

This is a 1961 FL. Cases are great, I installed a S&S 4 1/2" stroker kit. Did the case mods, don't like the holes for lowering the oil return in the cylinder, seems like they would weaken case, any trouble with that by anyone?

It had an andrews A grind in it that I liked so I bought a new one. Old pinion was black, new cam gear measures for black. I can feel no backlash (with oil, sorry) but the cam with no shim and the cover loose, slides back and for very nicely on the pinion. no binding.It all turns nicely. My fear is that an orange would be too lose and click, any thoughts? The old cam gear measures about .0005 smaller than the new one. It wore well and did not whine.

The other thing I noticed, and it ran this way before, is I have .011" between the # 1 exhaust lobe (I think) and the timer gear. Is a miss as good as a mile? I hope.

I also bought after market radio active chinese iron cylinders. The only ones around that I could find. They honed up ok so far. I don't have the old barrels to compare, but these thing seem really loose in the case and over the studs. They float a lot. If this is how the stock barrels are, where do you bolt them down? Shoot for the center of all the movement? Seems weird to me.

Which base gaskets does the majority like. I have both, James metal with the orange sealer, and thicker gray ones. Same with head gaskets, fire ring? James gray with orange sealer or blue teflon coated?

Finally (for now), I have set of later triangular pieces for under the barrel nuts, think they are shovel, I don't like the look but if they are better I will run them.

I am going to try and check all my valve to piston and valve to valve clearances this week end and button it up, if I don't have some problem that hasn't come up yet. Thanks a bunch, and man has this site changed. It is way cool now, and I am glad to be back!

Scott



mbskeam
Posts: 1004
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 5:52 am
Location: Sultan, WASH
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Re: Back from hell and trying to assemble my pan project.

#2

Post by mbskeam » Fri Feb 27, 2009 2:25 am


This is a 1961 FL. Cases are great, I installed a S&S 4 1/2" stroker kit. Did the case mods, don't like the holes for lowering the oil return in the cylinder, seems like they would weaken case, any trouble with that by anyone?


look here....
viewtopic.php?f=61&t=4958



It had an andrews A grind in it that I liked so I bought a new one. Old pinion was black, new cam gear measures for black. I can feel no backlash (with oil, sorry) but the cam with no shim and the cover loose, slides back and for very nicely on the pinion. no binding.It all turns nicely. My fear is that an orange would be too lose and click, any thoughts? The old cam gear measures about .0005 smaller than the new one. It wore well and did not whine.

this is how I did mine and it is just right, if you can feel ANY lash it will clatter. you set it up right.....


The other thing I noticed, and it ran this way before, is I have .011" between the # 1 exhaust lobe (I think) and the timer gear. Is a miss as good as a mile? I hope.

pretty close, I would shoot for a bit more...


I also bought after market radio active chinese iron cylinders. The only ones around that I could find. They honed up ok so far. I don't have the old barrels to compare, but these thing seem really loose in the case and over the studs. They float a lot. If this is how the stock barrels are, where do you bolt them down? Shoot for the center of all the movement? Seems weird to me.


push the front cyl to the front and the back cyl. to the back, they will move this way as the engine runs, I know this first hand, they will move as the crank try's to push the cyls away from the center line of the cases.as to the quility ,some are good some are bad, cant help you there...


Which base gaskets does the majority like. I have both, James metal with the orange sealer, and thicker gray ones. Same with head gaskets, fire ring? James gray with orange sealer or blue teflon coated?


the metal ones WILL LEAK, they are CRAP.......
viewtopic.php?f=61&t=2169

use the Teflon blue, these are good, and for the base, I like the paper type, get shovel ones and put your oil holes in so that they match your cases, custom fit


Finally (for now), I have set of later triangular pieces for under the barrel nuts, think they are shovel, I don't like the look but if they are better I will run them.

no help from me on this no experiences with these....


good to have ya back....

fourthgear
Posts: 1390
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2005 1:12 pm
Location: north florida

Re: Back from hell and trying to assemble my pan project.

#3

Post by fourthgear » Fri Feb 27, 2009 4:16 am

Man panwars , sorry to hear about that stuff , how dare they get in the way of your Pan build .
Mostly what mbskeam wrote and both cams I put in my Pans , I had to cut back the gear . Both were Crane cams , so that may be why, not sure . If you had an "A" in there , it may not be a problem.

My 65 is stroked and I went with a Crane 300H because I went back to hydr. lifters & its a smooth running motor . There was a Andrews " B " grind in her when I bought her , but was shot like the rest of the motor , so I can't relate to ya how good it was . I think The " A ' is close to the 300H.

There was something (I think ) about the wall thickness of shovel cyl , that they used the triangler washers insted of the round ones , they should work .

Glad to see ya back on track , hope all that other stuff just fades away.

panwars
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 3:40 pm
Bikes: 61FL in a late 49 frame.
59FLH almost stock
Location: Wa state

Re: Back from hell and trying to assemble my pan project.

#4

Post by panwars » Sat Feb 28, 2009 3:37 am

Thanks guys, it is good to be back. Thanks for the info. I like the loading the barrels the way they will be pushed, makes total sense. I have been fighting with myself over cutting the timer gear or not. .011" is close but gears would have to grow or the cam move closer...I know it went thousands of miles this way...hate like hell to cut a perfectly good gear..know what i mean. Maybe I'll post this seperately and see if any one else is running an A grind without cutting the gear.

Scott

Cotten
Posts: 6911
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 9:09 am
Location: Central Illinois

Re: Back from hell and trying to assemble my pan project.

#5

Post by Cotten » Sat Feb 28, 2009 4:53 am

The triangular blanchards were introduced in the early 80s to disperse the fastener distortion upon cylinder base castings. A stock 80" Chubble is already bored to where it needs torqueplates to provide a proper re-bore, as fastener stress moves the spigot dramatically.

Thus the blanchards should be used when fitting pistons.

The blanchards work great.
But they are not pretty, nor correct for an earlier machine.

I think I have them on my .115" overbore Knuck, but I better look to be sure. It's been a while.

....Cotten
PS:
No comment on the aftermarket diversions.

panwars
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 3:40 pm
Bikes: 61FL in a late 49 frame.
59FLH almost stock
Location: Wa state

Re: Back from hell and trying to assemble my pan project.

#6

Post by panwars » Sat Feb 28, 2009 5:17 am

Thanks Cotten,

This thing is a 61fl in a 49 frame so I am not too concerned with proper, and these blanchards do look like they would really be affective, they are even arched a little to load the fastener and spread load I guess. I'll paint them flat black to hide them a little. The Chinese jugs may need all the help they can get.

I did score an almost stock 59 flh recently, that has an nice original police speedo. I plan on doing it as original as possible, with oem parts. It is foot shift, but will be hand shift when done. I guess I will be building a bike around a speedo but what the hell.

Back to the 61 for now.

Scott

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