Create your own blog: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=17487

Brakes

Forum rules
Please do not start new topics here, but here: New Panhead and Flathead topics
Post Reply
58flh
Posts: 3338
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 1:54 pm
Bikes: 1958flh 1969sporty,had a knuckle but sold back to original owner
Location: NEW JERSEY

Brakes

#1

Post by 58flh » Thu May 05, 2011 2:18 pm

Whats-up guys,hope everyone is up and running!---( however my pan is running great but for one problem--rear brake!) I put a new set of shoes on the old 2 spring mechanical set-up im running. I filed the pads at each end about 45 degree angle, checked all the inards everything looked good ,no slop & everything functioned fine! When i put it all together i pushed the bike to get it into the garage and the rear wheel locked-up!. So I loosened the axel nut readjusted the brake,tighted it all back-up & it seemed to work good!. I fired it up & went for a ride ,I got about a half-mile & it locked-up to a skid, good thing nobody was on my ass!. Slowly rode it back to the shop & it skid once more at about 5mph. by my shop. Im thinking to do this-- take the wheel backoff, check the brakes for the scuff-marks & file them to suit!---also the drum was a little off, but i chucked it up in my lathe & olny removed the bad areas. it was actually not that big of a deal,I have seen worse put back in service with no problems. Any body ever exp. this problem--im sure you have,this is a first for me in the last 26yrs. for my pan, Any input would be greatly appreciated, THANK-YOU----58flh



RUBONE
Moderator
Posts: 4932
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:09 am
Bikes: Multiple H-D, Ducati, BMW, Triumph, BSA,...

Re: Brakes

#2

Post by RUBONE » Thu May 05, 2011 3:17 pm

It sounds like a problem with the shoes and drum being different shapes. If the shoes contact on the leading edge they can create a self-servo effect and force themselves tighter against the drum. They need to be arced or otherwise fitted. Did you also center them properly? How much wear is on the actuating cam and the related surfaces. If the angle of the cam is too great the self-servo action will also cause it to go nearly over-center and lock up. Sometimes the surface of the shoes needs to be built up to keep the angle shallow. And lube the faces well with a very sticky grease.
Robbie

Panshovevo
Posts: 293
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 5:18 pm
Bikes: '50 F model, '76FX/L, '96 96" FXDWG
Location: SE Florida
Contact:

Re: Brakes

#3

Post by Panshovevo » Thu May 05, 2011 3:28 pm

RUBONE wrote: Sometimes the surface of the shoes needs to be built up to keep the angle shallow. And lube the faces well with a very sticky grease.
Robbie
I'm LOL picturing someone taking this too literally...

Regards,
John

RUBONE
Moderator
Posts: 4932
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:09 am
Bikes: Multiple H-D, Ducati, BMW, Triumph, BSA,...

Re: Brakes

#4

Post by RUBONE » Thu May 05, 2011 4:58 pm

Yes, that is funny. :oops:
It should say actuating surface where the cam bears on it. :roll:
Robbie

Panshovevo
Posts: 293
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 5:18 pm
Bikes: '50 F model, '76FX/L, '96 96" FXDWG
Location: SE Florida
Contact:

Re: Brakes

#5

Post by Panshovevo » Thu May 05, 2011 5:07 pm

RUBONE wrote:Yes, that is funny. :oops:
It should say actuating surface where the cam bears on it. :roll:
Robbie
Don't take it personally, Robbie, my mind works in strange ways.

Regards,
John

duoglide58
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Oklahoma City

Re: Brakes

#6

Post by duoglide58 » Thu May 05, 2011 6:18 pm

Are all of you components correct for the 58-62 setup. I had some mixed parts at one time and the spacer behind the backing plate caused my setup to get cocked slightly and I cracked the shoes etc. Here are a couople of threads that might help.
Doug

Rear Wheel locking up
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1474&hilit=+brake" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Duoglide Rear Drum
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=8001&hilit=+brake" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

58flh
Posts: 3338
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 1:54 pm
Bikes: 1958flh 1969sporty,had a knuckle but sold back to original owner
Location: NEW JERSEY

Re: Brakes

#7

Post by 58flh » Fri May 06, 2011 1:38 pm

Guys my hats-off to you---Thanks for all the input! Rubone, Doug58----The links you left for me to check-out were a real help!---once again thanks to all!!! 58flh---P.S. Ill let you know how I made out, Im gonna do this early Saturday Morning. ( remember boys Keep it upright & in 4th at about 5000-rpm, sound good). 58flh

hplhd
Site sponsor
Site sponsor
Posts: 612
Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:16 pm
Bikes: 1998 heritage springer
Location: indiana, usa

Re: Brakes

#8

Post by hplhd » Fri May 06, 2011 8:29 pm

5000 rpm :shock:

Bigincher
Posts: 2830
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:10 pm
Bikes: 1941/59 EL
1952 FL
1977 FLH
1994 Fatboy

Re: Brakes

#9

Post by Bigincher » Sat May 07, 2011 12:56 am

hplhd wrote:5000 rpm :shock:
Yeah Rich, I think that's WFO...!

RUBONE
Moderator
Posts: 4932
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:09 am
Bikes: Multiple H-D, Ducati, BMW, Triumph, BSA,...

Re: Brakes

#10

Post by RUBONE » Sat May 07, 2011 12:58 am

5000 rpm :shock:
I used to shift one of my shovel strokers at an indicated 7000 on the Sportster Mechanical tach I drove off the top of the mag. It was a beastly thing!
But then I've always been a fan of RPMs----------
Robbie

Bigincher
Posts: 2830
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:10 pm
Bikes: 1941/59 EL
1952 FL
1977 FLH
1994 Fatboy

Re: Brakes

#11

Post by Bigincher » Sat May 07, 2011 1:23 am

I like RPMs too, if the motor is built for it.

Here's an interesting story--- my long-time riding partner (30 years) and I each bought brand new Evo Fatboys in the mid-90's. Being since we both like maximum performance, we immediately did some upgrades--- high-performance aftermarket heads, cam, carb, ignition, exhaust. We built those machines for high-revving and "breathing". They really 'smoked'....
Not too many years later, my partner decided to take it another step, and put some stroker wheels in his motor. I decided that a well-breathing motor tuned for higher R's was where I wanted to be, and gave the stroker wheels a pass....
Wasn't too much later, and my partner's motor broke the crank pin. Pretty major failure. He repaired that, and within 6 months, snapped the crank pin again. Both were high quality, I think either James or S&S. After the second failure, he hasn't ran that motor since. (He aquired a really nice hot-rod and totally 'custom' '49 pan after that). But my own little Evo motor has been more reliable than ever---
So, if you're still with me after all this rambling, I am a firm believer in building a motor to breathe well at higher Rs than to build a torque monster stroker with higher piston speed....
We've never figured out 'why' his crank pins failed, it doesn't make sense----

hplhd
Site sponsor
Site sponsor
Posts: 612
Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:16 pm
Bikes: 1998 heritage springer
Location: indiana, usa

Re: Brakes

#12

Post by hplhd » Sat May 07, 2011 2:17 am

i was picturing cruising down the hiway in 4th at 5g's. that seemed kinda high.

Panshovevo
Posts: 293
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 5:18 pm
Bikes: '50 F model, '76FX/L, '96 96" FXDWG
Location: SE Florida
Contact:

Re: Brakes

#13

Post by Panshovevo » Sat May 07, 2011 3:10 pm

Tom,
What length stroke did your partner use?
I installed an S&S 96" kit (3 5/8" bore, 4 5/8" stroke in my '96 Evo several years ago. I now have approx 12,000 miles on it, admittedly mostly highway and minimal throttle opening riding (it doesn't take much to keep up with friends with stock bikes), but with enough WFO to wear out rear tires pretty rapidly just from 1st to 2nd powershifts (I don't do burnouts). It also has head, cam, carb, ignition, clutch, exhaust, and tire upgrades. It also doesn't see much over 6000 rpm.
It has been reliable thus far, knock on wood.
A friend has a set of 4 3/4" wheels, rods, and stock bore pistons that will fit my Shovel, and I am wondering how rideable it would be. Does the perceived vibration increase as you stretch the stroke without increasing the bore? Does it increase with bore size?

To simplify the question, which would likely vibrate more, a long stroke motor with standard bore, or a long stroke motor with a big bore? Or does it depend entirely on balance?

Regards,
John

Bigincher
Posts: 2830
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:10 pm
Bikes: 1941/59 EL
1952 FL
1977 FLH
1994 Fatboy

Re: Brakes

#14

Post by Bigincher » Sun May 08, 2011 12:47 am

Panshovevo, I won't pretend to be that much of a 'motor man' around these guys here who really are! And they can better answer your questions than I.... and we'll both probably learn something. But one thing I do know, with a greater stroke comes a faster piston speed and more heat--- since the piston must travel farther for the same revolution of the flywheels, it does it faster-- make sense? So higher revs should be avoided, so as not to agravate the heat issue...

I don't recall what stroke my old pardner went with--- but I think I recall that it was stock bore and 96-inches, 4-3/4" stroke. We still have no idea why the crank pin broke--- twice.

kitabel
Posts: 840
Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2010 7:10 pm
Bikes: 2008 96" Fat Boy TC
Location: Lynbrook, New York
Contact:

Re: Brakes

#15

Post by kitabel » Sun May 08, 2011 4:09 am

High RPM is far more destructive than a longer stroke.

Post Reply

Return to “Brakes”