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0il in the rear exhaust port

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0il in the rear exhaust port

#1

Post by panbagger » Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:39 am

I have a 52 pan, a year ago i had the heads redone 4 new guides and 2 exhaust valves. Put the heads back on when the motor got warm it made noise and would smoke. found the noise(the tins had to be clearenced so the valves wouldn't hit)but it is still smoking. there is oil in the rear exhaust port and don't know where it is coming from. Any one have any ideas?



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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#2

Post by partshunt » Sat Jul 17, 2010 10:42 am

Pretty hard to say from where I'm sittin. Possibly if the tip of the guide looks washed and a little too clean, may indicate valve stem seal, especially if the piston top is reasonably dry by viewing thru the spark plug hole. the next thing I might suggest is a compression test if the piton top is also wet. It may have developed and ring or cyl wall problem. Does the exhaust valve stem look too wet and clean indicating a valve stem seal?....Joe

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#3

Post by panbagger » Sat Jul 17, 2010 12:40 pm

when i had the heads off i also pulled the cylinders off and re re-ringed the pistons, so i really don't think it is piston problems. there are also no valve stem seals, don't remember why he didn't put them on clearance issue or something like that don't remember that was a year ago when i had the heads done. I have only put maybe a hundred miles on it since this has all occurred. any other ideas?

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#4

Post by Panacea » Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:43 pm

Headhog did my last valve job and used no seals. Works fine...Mike

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#5

Post by partshunt » Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:45 pm

Well, maybe valve stem seals is what you need?...Joe

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#6

Post by partshunt » Sat Jul 17, 2010 8:09 pm

Yes, originally, panheads used no valve stem seals. However, with all the miles on these engines now and rocker arm wear, its possible that there is more oil in the rocker covers these days from older worn rocker arms swamping the valve guides. Valve stem seals are now supplied in most aftermaket top O/H kits so why not be on the safe side and just use em? my 2 cents anyway...Joe :)

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#7

Post by panbagger » Sat Jul 17, 2010 9:16 pm

yeah i agree that there should be valve stem seals, but the guy that did my heads said that he would have to do a lot of work to put them on because of my cam and said i really didn't need them. This guy that did my heads is supposed to be reputable but now i don't know. so tomorrow I am taking them to a guy that works for a high well known performance head company. really appreciate all the knowledge on this web site and the people on it and any more ideas are always welcome. Thank you all again.

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#8

Post by RUBONE » Sun Jul 18, 2010 2:18 am

Was any porting or other type of work done to the heads? Sometimes the castings are porous enough that oil will go through them into a port. Also, if the rockers were hitting the Pans your builder must not have checked the assembled height, a no-no since that also affects rocker pad position and creates stress on stems and guides along with accelerated wear, not to mention the clearance issue. And you mentioned a cam, what is it?
Robbie

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#9

Post by panbagger » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:50 am

there was no porting done to the heads, and the rockers weren't hitting the pans, the spring collars were leaving smiley faces in the cover. It isn't a big cam just a little over stock. This is my first pan but I have had it for almost 10 years, and you know how it is there is always a learning curve and you never know whats going to happen next. I didn't have this problem before I got the heads done and I am not saying it his fault but, wasn't like this before.

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#10

Post by RUBONE » Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:17 pm

What causes collars to hit valve covers are the valves sunk too deeply into the heads. That allows the entire valve and spring assembly to ride too high. It also changes the angle of the rocker arms. H-D has specifications for those heights and there is a reason for them! The factory oversized valves were not for better performance but were to pull the valve back down into the head. When the valves are too deep they also restrict gas flow, so even with a higher performance cam some of that is lost due to that restriction.
In most cases there is plenty of room even with a mild cam for stem seals, however if the valve to guide clearance is correct they are rarely needed on a Pan. But they may be if things like oil pumps for more flow are added to the equation.
Robbie

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#11

Post by panbagger » Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:43 pm

The valve heights are within in specs, don't know why they hit but they did, so the guy that built the engine years ago clearanced the covers for me. He is not the guy who did the heads. The guy that did the heads told the guy that built the motor they would have to be clearenced. Can't exactly remember why he didn't put seals on it but that was a year ago, and sometimes i have a hard time remembering what happened yesterday. You also said if the heads where to porous they could leak is there any way to stop this?

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#12

Post by RUBONE » Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:49 pm

You can deal with most porosity issues by cleaning the surface of the casting really well and using Glyptol to seal the surface. It has the added affect of helping oil drain as well.
Robbie

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#13

Post by panbagger » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:02 pm

what is glyptol, and were can you find it? And how do you know if they are to porous?

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#14

Post by RUBONE » Sun Jul 18, 2010 7:29 pm

Glyptol is a sealer generally used in the electrical industry. It is a red liquid sealer that fills and seals all pores in castings. Like the stuff H-D used in their crankcases. Do a search on this forum and you will find plenty of info on it. It is available various places but Eastwood caters to the vintage vehicle restorers.
The only way to tell if a casting is porous is to pressurize it, or merely observe where oil oozes through it!
Robbie

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Re: 0il in the rear exhaust port

#15

Post by panbagger » Sun Jul 18, 2010 8:32 pm

ok thanks. Hopefully I will be able to have a different person look at the head today and we can figure out the problem. Thanks for your help, all information is always welcome. Thank you
Scott

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