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Battery elimination

Electrical issues
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kell
Posts: 404
Joined: Sat Jun 19, 2004 2:58 am

Battery elimination

#1

Post by kell » Thu Dec 18, 2003 5:20 pm

Description: Does anybody here know someone that has actually done that?

I saw something in The Horse a while back about starting a bike without a battery. They said the guy kicks the bike six or eight times to charge a capacitor, so then he can start it. It requires an alternator so I can't try it on my bike, but does anybody here know someone that has actually done that? It's hard to believe it actually works.



warhog
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:32 pm

Re: Battery elimination

#2

Post by warhog » Fri Dec 19, 2003 5:08 pm

Hi Kell,

I have started and run my 45 without the battery, but I have my bike converted to a magneto.

DuoDave
Posts: 234
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 10:45 pm

Re: Battery elimination

#3

Post by DuoDave » Sat Dec 20, 2003 1:59 am

I could be imagining things here, but isn't this the set up that the Norton Commando had? I've been using Boyer electronic ignition on my Commando for the last twenty years, so I can't remember the details of the original arrangement. I will be back home again tomorrow, so I will check the workshop manual.
The U.K classic bike magazines carry adverts for battery eliminators for old Brit bikes. They are little black boxes full of electronic gizmos. I don't know if this the sort of thing you are talking about. When it comes to electrics, I am not too switched on! ;D


Okay, looks like some of the old memory cells are still functioning. The Norton Commando is equiped with an electrolytic capacitor which is supposed to allow you to start and run the bike, including the lights, if the battery craps out. It says in the book you can run the bike with the battery disconnected. I had completely forgotten about this facility, despite the fact that the capacitor is staring me in the face every time I look under the seat of my Commando. Doh!
Guess I'll have to go and give it a try now.

DuoDave
Posts: 234
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 10:45 pm

Re: Battery elimination

#4

Post by DuoDave » Tue Dec 23, 2003 1:22 pm

Check out http://www.motorcycle-parts.com.au/boyer_bransden.htm
Go to "Power Box", I think this is the type of unit you are talking about. It states that the unit is not suitable for use with a generator . However, I had a look at the Commando wiring diagram and the capacitor is wired in downstream of the rectifier. As it is being fed direct current, it may be that a Commando capacitor would work on a Panhead with a 12 volt generator. I guess it depends on whether the generator can crank out enough juice to power up the capacitor. Might be worth a try, though.

Sorry, I missed the capital letters from Boyer Bransden. Try http://www.motorcycle-parts.com.au/Boyer_Bransden.htm
If computers are so darned smart, how come they can't figure out something like this?

kell
Posts: 404
Joined: Sat Jun 19, 2004 2:58 am

Re: Battery elimination

#5

Post by kell » Wed Dec 24, 2003 4:04 am

Yeah, according to the ad copy their system works for bikes with permanent magnet alternators. There's a good reason for that. Anything with field coils won't cut the mustard on its own for kick starting; you've gotta have juice coming out at the really really low revs. That means magnets, not coils.
A few months ago I attempted a little project of taking the field coils out of the generator on my pan and replacing them with permanent magnets, but it was a failure. So I guess any conversion to batteryless operation would either require getting an aftermarket alternator or going to a magneto.
I would have liked to do it homebrew, 'cause I love working with the electrical stuff. And it would be so cool to have tools in the oil tank instead of that annoying battery. But I saw in The Horse that some guy mounted his battery inside his (open belt) primary, so maybe I'll try that with mine. I really crave that space in the oil tank.

DuoDave
Posts: 234
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 10:45 pm

Re: Battery elimination

#6

Post by DuoDave » Wed Dec 24, 2003 9:36 am

Yes, I had an idea that a generator didn't put out enough power at kicking speed. It's nice to know why.
Check out the Cyclon batteries at http://hamcall.net/hawker.html

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