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Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

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mr. z
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Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#1

Post by mr. z » Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:33 am

After owning this 1950 transmission of mine for nearly two decades, I had a situation yesterday, for the first time ever.

I was going over my routine maintenence and found one of my trans mounting stud nuts was loose. I have never had these tighter then 30-35 lbs. This one nut seemed to spin freely on the stud, but when I began to loosen it, the stud and all fell into my hand, it had apparently taken out what was left of the case threads with it. :evil:

I'm looking at either time serting the case,(with the trans out) and re-using the original stud, or considering doing an operation with the trans still installed in the bike, and using an oversize stud from Colony, after retapping, and then using retaining compound.

I read in the knowlege base where VT had this situation with all four studs loose and leaky in a brand new trans from V-twin, but he didn't follow up on how it came out eventually. Would have liked to have known if using time-serts in this area is a good idea, or could they cause that area to leak?

I had just pulled this trans over the winter to fix leaks and alighn the shift forks, would really hope my trans-in oper. is possilble, as pulling mine is a time-comsuming hassle(oil tank, pipes etc). This is my first crack at one of these, any thoughts would be appreciated, and thanx in advance



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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#2

Post by Hog54 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:45 am

I cant see how the timesert would leak and you wont have anything stronger.

mr. z
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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#3

Post by mr. z » Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:27 am

Hog54 wrote:I cant see how the timesert would leak and you wont have anything stronger.
I'm kinda thinking that is the best way too, not lookin' forward to pullin' everything again,after such a short time, but it is what it is. The stud hole in question is the left front, behind the primary cover not too hard to reach with the bike on my lift, but we'll see.
Last edited by mr. z on Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#4

Post by RUBONE » Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:16 am

The factory repair was an oversize stud. Quick and dirty. The timesert will serve you well. Like the saying goes, "do it right, do it once".
Robbie

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#5

Post by RCamp » Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:36 pm

Timesert or oversize stud, check to see if your tap will fit through the slot in the mounting plate, not a lot of play there. Also, I would put some heavy grease up in the hole to trap the metal from the drilling and tapping, then swap it out afterward.

Ralph

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#6

Post by FlatHeadSix » Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:20 pm

z
Like Robbie said, "do it right, do it once". There are no shortcuts, the oversize stud is not a repair, it is just a bandaid. Here's a link to a discussion we had here a couple years ago about the same thing. I had an oversize stud in my '31 VL tranny and it came loose.
mike
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6786&hilit=oversize+stud
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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#7

Post by 1951 adam » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:00 am

Heli coil is a much cleaner repair then time sert...I like things that dont look repaired, and heli coil works well.

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#8

Post by mr. z » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:14 am

Thanx everyone, I knew y'all would come thru. Just one of those nasty little things that can't be done half-assed. My bike is a bit of a mutt, but I pride myself on everything on it being done right, I like to reverse the previous abuse inflicted on these old parts, and make 'em right again. :)

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#9

Post by 1951 adam » Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:35 pm

WELL SAID!! Good luck, doing it the right way is the only way..

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#10

Post by 51Hog » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:17 pm

I have been trying to decide why a heli coil is more correct , or better than the over sized stud.
The hole that you drill and tap for the coil is about the same size of the hole that you drill and tap for the stud. The strength is the same.
The only benefit that I see to using a coil is if you were to run the stud in and out many times, you would not damage the aluminum threads.
That is if the coil did not back out with the stud...... But , how many times do you remove the stud....
Dale

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#11

Post by 1962FLH » Wed Jul 04, 2012 9:20 pm

Weld it up, drill and tap to correct size.

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#12

Post by 1951 adam » Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:47 pm

For me a heli coil looks no different then or not much different then the original tapped aluminum, thats the advantage to me, as well as strength...time serts look like they have been installed, thats all.... welding? is that really needed for this repair? probably not.

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#13

Post by FlatHeadSix » Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:12 am

51Hog wrote:I have been trying to decide why a heli coil is more correct , or better than the over sized stud.
....Dale
Dale,
There is actually nothing wrong with an oversize stud if it is installed correctly to begin with. If you read the original thread that my picture came from I think I explained why I installed the Heli-Coil. The oversize stud that was in my tranny case had worked loose, it was cocked over to one side, and it leaked. I don't know why it did that, I'm sure it had been in that case a long time, and it was probably installed with the transmission still in the bike. Probably a bad installation when it was done.
Anyway, either a Heli-Coil or an oversize will work just fine if they are put in correctly, and the transmission should be out of the frame and upside down to do it, in my opinion.
mike

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Re: Well, it finally happend (trans. stud)

#14

Post by 51Hog » Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:56 am

Thanks for the reply Mike.
I Like the idea of the 1 mechanical joint vs. the two created with the coil.
I believe that they would be equal in strength tho.
Dale

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