Handshift headache

I bought a 65 pan footshift basket case, want to run a handshift with a tank mounted gate

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Gearbox
Posts: 38
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2007 3:08 pm

Handshift headache

#1

Post by Gearbox » Sun May 16, 2004 8:17 pm

Hey Guys, brand new to this site, looks like a lot of great info available. Hope someone can offer some assistance. Had the lid off my 65 pan trans all day..been sittin at the kitchen table with a old manual bunch of books and a ole lady screamin cause gear lube drippin on her place mats..heres the delima. I bought a 65 pan footshift basket case, want to run a handshift with a tank mounted gate, so I buy a handshift lid which has the neutral light switch, it also has a "R" stamped on the boss supposed to mean a reverse type lid I guess. From all my books, I'm using the right shift drum, and the shift lever gear has the teeth 1/2 way around , and what looks like the knotch for the light, but when I time the shift gear and the drum and install the lever pointing up and to the left as per the manual, the drum seems to rotate all wrong, spins upside down. when I have the neutral light depressed the drum seems out of time, and no-where close to the shift gate identification. I'm trying to use the tank gate from 47-65 1st is at the front then back, lever only seems to work if I have it poiting down not straight up, when I shift it like it should be at the table, I run out of teeth on the gear. Do I have to run the 66 style shifter on the frame is the gate positions different, or am I missing a step, all jammed up and needing help. Thanks Gearbox. ???



Gearbox
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Re: Handshift headache

#2

Post by Gearbox » Sun May 16, 2004 8:57 pm

My mistake, on my gate first is at the back by your knee, the you push it forward. I think by my books the 66 version is first is all the way ahead then you pull it back for the next gears? Does anybody have a clue as to what type of hand shifter come on the 65 year? Or do you think I have to run the drum as it is irregardless of the neutral light and gate pattern, just use it opposite as it is supposed to be?, there must be a proper fix to this problem. ???

Cotten
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Re: Handshift headache

#3

Post by Cotten » Sun May 16, 2004 10:39 pm

Gearbox!

I have several '65 handshift gearboxes, although they are all at the shop, or installed (like on my wife's '65).
As I read your post, the first thing that strikes me is "install the lever pointing up and to the left as per the manual".
The lever points down and forward.
Please ignore any '66 instructions as they are nearly always for the frame mounted ratchet-top assemblies.
You indicate that you have replaced the reverse drum with the correct one?
Sorry for the short and incomplete reply, but duty calls. Will be back soon;

.....Cotten

Gearbox
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Re: Handshift headache

#4

Post by Gearbox » Sun May 16, 2004 11:57 pm

Thanks Cotten, I look forward to hearing your reply, when I look at my lid and drum it looks like the lever should fit in the downward position, Ive been staring at this piece for two days, now I think I've confused myself so bad I don't know which way is up or down, It sure sounds like you will be able to help me out, I look forward to your reply, all I need to do is get this shifter aligned properly, a little playing around with the timing and linkert, then I will be riding the backroads again. Thanks again for the reply.

Cotten
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Re: Handshift headache

#5

Post by Cotten » Mon May 17, 2004 12:33 am

OK I'm back (Had to hit the alleyways; Sunday night is scrounge night, and its a vicious competition, considering the price of scrap, and the eBay feeding frenzy.)

This will be a little testy without having an example (or a manual) in hand, but all '51-'65 assemblies go together the same. (So anyone who can make things clearer, please join in!)

Assuming you have the correct shift drum (or "cam") then installation is as per the book: the truncated or ground-off cornered tooth on the drum gear indexes to the line on the gear with the detente for the switch ( A bump, not a notch). I must use a felt tip pen to make it easy to see.
Then the shaft of the lever presses in (don't forget the leather seal). It can go in four different ways, since the hole is square, but it will aim down at the front corner of the gearcase when in neutral if, if all is in order. I use a screwdriver inside to compress the gear against the spring, and tap on the lever with a wooden mallet. The cotterpin is always a test of patience.
The variables that come to mind are the drum (as mentioned) and the lever ('51 to '65 had a threaded hole for the rod.
I must ask whether you have the neutral switch with two screw terminals, or just a stud on the end.

Gearbox
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Re: Handshift headache

#6

Post by Gearbox » Mon May 17, 2004 1:24 am

Well Mr Cotten, I think you maybe on to something, I took the lid all apart and re-assembled it as per your instructions and it does appear as to be the correct way, now like you say if the drum is correct, I'm assuming it is because it matches the pictures that I have as describing a 4spd drum, both grooves are identical, I understand that the 3spd has a large rise on 1 groove. My neutral switch does have 2 screws. One question that I have once I re-install the lid, should I be using a swivel-bolt joint or a joint assy similiar to the front shifter mount? and my Japan Cross-over pipe seems to hit the linkages for both the clutch and shifter, any recomendations, I was thinkin of denting the pipe, but thats a little crude. One more question, when you have the lid and drum facing you, and you push the shift lever all the way forward, (pointing towards the neutral switch) as if you were going into first gear, is it normal for the split or line in the drum to be facing you and the grooves to be rotated almost all the way around to the right? Thanks again for your assistance.

Cotten
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Re: Handshift headache

#7

Post by Cotten » Mon May 17, 2004 2:50 am

The originals had the same clevis on both ends of the shift rod, but what ever works,..works. I ran a heim (ball) joint for many years.
Sorry about the pipe interference. Check out every possibility before using the up-and-down wrench (ball pein hammer).
Your last question is something I can only answer with a lid in my hand. With luck, I have one loose at the shop tomorrow.

kevsett
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Re: Handshift headache

#8

Post by kevsett » Mon May 17, 2004 1:48 pm

I have thought for at least 20 years that the last stock tank shift model was my 64, other than some servicars. Had no idea that 65's and maybe even up to 1967 were available as a stock tank shifter. Is this correct? If so I gotta stop telling everyone that my 64 is the last year of tank shift. But I can still say it is the last of the 6 volt/kickers, not to mention they were made during the year I was conceived.

Gearbox
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Re: Handshift headache

#9

Post by Gearbox » Mon May 17, 2004 10:24 pm

Just curious Mr. Cotten if ya had a chance to look at a lid today, and what the position of the drum turned out to be. Can you recommend a dual exhaust that actually fits, the set-up I have is from V-Twin, bought it about 6 years ago, but never ever bolted it up. Front pipe appears to short going into the sqaush pipe, and crossover hits all the linkage, not to mention oil lines super tight to rear pipe. I hate the thought of changing the sqaush pipe, looks like I would have to pull the engine, not much room to raise it with the covers in place? Any suggestions?

Gearbox
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Re: Handshift headache

#10

Post by Gearbox » Mon May 17, 2004 10:28 pm

Somehow I screw up my posting 65 pan aka Gearbox,maybe I will figure these computers out after I finish my ride.

Billy
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Re: Handshift headache

#11

Post by Billy » Mon May 17, 2004 11:21 pm

Gearbox, Don't sweat the small stuff!! ;)
I still type 1 finger, & I'm happy doing that!!

Cotten
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Re: Handshift headache

#12

Post by Cotten » Tue May 18, 2004 1:27 am

Sorry after a 14 hr Monday, I never found an un-stitched lid. Maybe tomorrow.

If you put everything in neutral, and when it sits on the case it has both shifters evenly spaced between their adjacent gears, yer there!

And Billy! Don't feel so bad, as the '65 tankshifts (nearly always police issue) used the '63-'64 3.5 gallon tanks!
As best I have encountered, all '66 and later used the frame mounted shifter for footclutches.

Billy
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Re: Handshift headache

#13

Post by Billy » Tue May 18, 2004 3:02 am

Friend of mine has a '67 Shov. w/frame mounted shifter & foot clutch.
Kevsett, You would be right about the last of 6 volt kickers. As The ServiCars went to 12 volt & E.Start in 1964, & auto-advance timers.
First Harley with E.Start !! 1964 ServiCar!! & still hand shifted till the "Official end in 1973" Which is what year my Flatty is!! ;D

DuoDave
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Re: Handshift headache

#14

Post by DuoDave » Tue May 18, 2004 8:08 am

65 Pan - If you remove the right footboard and mounting brackets and take of the footbrake mounting plate you should be able to wiggle the S pipe out okay.

Gearbox
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Re: Handshift headache

#15

Post by Gearbox » Tue May 18, 2004 7:53 pm

Thanks Duo Dave, I'll give it a try, just looks tight, I'll let you know if it will pry out of there. Gearbox

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