59 pan compesating sprocket question

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neilw
Posts: 233
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59 pan compesating sprocket question

#1

Post by neilw » Sat Jan 31, 2009 7:08 am

I'm not sure about one of the parts that make up the compensating sprocket assembly.it's in the photo ,I took a photo of each side.this is suposed to be 40292-55a
"sliding cam with shaft extention".The part I have is one peice,The parts book shows there should be outside splines sticking out of the opposite end to where the collar is .It also shows a large collar like what mine has ,but theres another collar that looks like it may be what there calling the shaft extention .If this is a 2 peice thing then that would make sense ,except I don't have the other peice ( maybe hidden somewhere ).
It looks to me like there should be a splined part that slides into the part in the photo,and it should have a collar on the end without the splines.
Also where does the "compensating sprocket shaft key" part 40390-54 go ? I don't see a keyway anywhere.
I just added another photo of all the peices I have .
Neil
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VT

Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#2

Post by VT » Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:38 pm

You don't need the compensator sprocket unless you're planning on pulling a sidecar. It's Harley's attempt at a rubber mounted motor. Just get yourself a stock-style 24-T motor sprocket and lose about 10 lbs. off your drive-train.
I ran around looking for parts to make mine work until the dealer removed the one I had installed, and told me the same story I'm telling you.

62pan
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#3

Post by 62pan » Sat Jan 31, 2009 4:18 pm

I disagree. The compensating sprocket helps smooth out the firing impulses from the motor at low RPMs. I have run both solid sprockets and the compensating type and in my opinion the low speed operation was smoother with the latter. What you seem to be missing is the sprocket shaft extension. That is the part that fits over the motors sprocket shaft and splines to the piece in the bottom picture.

Cotten
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#4

Post by Cotten » Sat Jan 31, 2009 4:30 pm

Neil!

A compensator is a very desirable piece of hardware, as it not only extends chain and clutch life, it also softens the torque stress upon the crank assembly itself. That's why the Factory adopted the hardware for nearly every BigTwin produced from the late '50s onward.

As 62Pan points out, your pictures do not show the splined top-hat-shaped sleeve that is pressed upon the sprocket shaft (nor the spring). The reference to a key would apply only to pre-'55 machines with a tapered shaft.

You aren't working with a Clymer excuse for a real Service Manual, are you?

....Cotten

neilw
Posts: 233
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 3:24 am
Bikes: 1995 Roadking(still brand new)
1991 HD springer
1959 pan (I'm reassembling)
1978 BMW R100RS
Location: Calgary

Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#5

Post by neilw » Sat Jan 31, 2009 6:34 pm

Thanks guys .
Does this top hat sleeve go on first ( before the sprocket? ) it would make sense that it does ,but the parts books dont show it that way.They just show it as one peice ,one part #.
Cotton you mentioned my pictures not showing the spring( "nor the spring" in your post ).I'm not missing a spring too am I ?
I see in the jp catalog you can buy this top hat part by itself,but no OEM number ,HD just sold it as a set with the sliding cam part 40292-55a. Is there a reason for this?
Oh yeah,Cotton I'm using the HD manual and Clymers ,Clymers is sort of like an idiots guide ( with mistakes evey now and then).I refer to it when HD gets to technical for me.(which doesn't take much)
Neil

Cotten
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#6

Post by Cotten » Sun Feb 01, 2009 1:49 am

Neil!

Ironically, (or sadly) even the Parts Book fails to properly show the sleeve that presses upon the sprocket shaft.

My attachment has a black arrow added to point to the sleeve pictured within the lower sliding collar.

The spring, which is obviously quite important, is #33.

So yes, the sleeve must be installed first, and the torque upon the "nut" (shown in very poor proportions to the rest of it..) installs it firmly upon the spacer against the Timken bearing.

As changes in lash in the chain produces a wide variance in drag upon the motor sprocket, the forces are diverted to the ramps of the opposing cams (whomever drew the Parts Book should be dug up and buried with Clymer's legacy), absorbing shock against the spring.

Its a good thing.

For historical reference, the aftermarket pioneered this innovation.
For Indian Chiefs, the "Powerflow" was offered to solve this problem before other versions appeared to assist H-D's.
By '50 or so, the Wigwam incorporated the idea into production with a splined sprocket shaft. H-D was quite late to catch up with an add-on for their tapered shafts somewhere around '53.

It is safe to assume H-D's switch to expensive splined shafts in '55 was focused upon this solution to a very significant problem.
As horsespower was increased, the need for a torque-evener became increasingly critical.

...Cotten
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awander
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#7

Post by awander » Sun Feb 01, 2009 3:37 am

neilw:

The spring in your photo is the #33 in Cotten's illustration.

Cotten, I'm not sure how you missed seeing that spring in the first photo by neilw.

Cotten
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#8

Post by Cotten » Sun Feb 01, 2009 4:33 am

Awander posted:
"Cotten, I'm not sure how you missed seeing that spring in the first photo by neilw."

If I right-click "save image as" to my photo editor, I can scroll to the left half of large pics without an "illegal operation" box popping up.
The last update of Firefox has crippled all viewing, since I am still using WIN98SE.

Otherwise, my dial-up connection doesn't often to want to offer much but a little box with a red X in it. If my server gets any slower, I might as well give up.

My Explorer crapped out a couple of years ago, and there is no hope of fixing that!

...Cotten

panhead
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#9

Post by panhead » Sun Feb 01, 2009 11:07 am

Cotten, try Opera as browser.

john HD
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#10

Post by john HD » Sun Feb 01, 2009 2:35 pm

cotten,

i have gotten XP to work on pentium III boxes, i also have a copy of win 2K you are welcome to have.

lemme know if you are interested.

as far as the comp sprocket goes i agree, it makes the whole bike work better. the shifting improvement alone is worth the trouble to get it installed.

john

biker_k
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#11

Post by biker_k » Sun Feb 01, 2009 8:54 pm

neilw,
Once you get the parts sorted out....don't forget that you have to shim the sprocket assy to preload the spring. I learned this the hard way......if you don't preload the assy, it will slip like the worst loose clutch that you ever imagined. Apparently, you can't buy the shims, so you will need to make them your self.

I think that the compensating sprocket assy is necessary too. When I took mine off I could definitely feel the torque surges and it wore out my primary chain a lot quicker. I'd go through the effort to install it if I were you.

neilw
Posts: 233
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 3:24 am
Bikes: 1995 Roadking(still brand new)
1991 HD springer
1959 pan (I'm reassembling)
1978 BMW R100RS
Location: Calgary

Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#12

Post by neilw » Sun Feb 01, 2009 11:12 pm

Thanks a lot guys for all the info.BTW when I quoted cotton's "nor the spring" ,and asked if I was missing a spring ,
i now just realized it was a typo error as the t & r are side by side on the keyboard ,and this should have read "not the spring".If I'm right it all makes sense..I guess I'm gonna order one of these sleeves . I didn't know about shimming and preloading the Compensating sprocket .I'll be figuring all that out when my sleeve arrives..
Neil

Cotten
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Location: Central Illinois

Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#13

Post by Cotten » Mon Feb 02, 2009 3:56 am

John!
I appreciate the offer of a newer dos (or whatever it is called), but I don't think I have a Pentium III chip in this chassis; It is concocted from alley refugees by my local geek, and the dumpsters are reeaallllly slim right now, so it is unlikely that one shall appear soon.

Panhead!
Is "Opera" a free download? Gotta link?

My server sux too.

....Cotten

panhead
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#14

Post by panhead » Mon Feb 02, 2009 8:17 am

It's a free download: http://www.opera.com/

DuoDave
Posts: 198
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Re: 59 pan compesating sprocket question

#15

Post by DuoDave » Mon Feb 02, 2009 10:22 pm

Variations on the compensating sprocket appear on many old British bikes, so the manufacturers over here also saw it as a desirable feature. Eventually somebody figured out that it was a lot simpler and lighter to fit some rubber buffers in the rear wheel hub. Harley Davidson of course stubbornly carried on with their original idea. (Them new fangled doo dads will never catch on).

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