Aligning shift forks to top...

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Kuda
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Aligning shift forks to top...

#1

Post by Kuda » Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:33 pm

So thanks to the very generous offer by Concrete Guy, I've got a good handshift top coming my way. Now I've got another issue (well, another transmission issue: let's keep this simple.) :mrgreen: I used the crappy old drum to attempt to line up the top with my fancy new Jims alignment tool ($86 new, can't beat that!). Here's the problem: in attempting to get nearly the same spacing between the gears, I found that there's a fair bit of sideplay on the forks. In other words, using a .050 shim, I can push it between two gears, but when I switch to the other side, the fork will slide over at least .050 and then it'll fit in that side too. I'd rather not try to "average" the spacing, I've seen a trans lock in two gears doing 50 mph and it was NOT pretty. At all.

I looked at the forks themselves, they appear to be Andrews forks and they have a few shiny spots but don't look worn out or bent. So I guess the question is, how much sideplay is acceptable? And what's next?

-Kuda
'49 panchop (transless)



Bosheff
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#2

Post by Bosheff » Mon Oct 26, 2009 10:56 pm

With the shims that are available for aligning the forks, you should be able to get the forks dead nuts on. Are you possibly saying that the paths in the shift drum are not manufactured to the proper width? Try to get yer hands on a real H-D shift drum. Don't forget the clown hats....bosheff

Kuda
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#3

Post by Kuda » Mon Oct 26, 2009 11:25 pm

Bosheff wrote:With the shims that are available for aligning the forks, you should be able to get the forks dead nuts on. Are you possibly saying that the paths in the shift drum are not manufactured to the proper width? Try to get yer hands on a real H-D shift drum. Don't forget the clown hats....bosheff
Guess I didn't explain it right. When I check the distance between the slider and the gear, even with the alignment gauge on the fork (with the rollers or "hats" on), the slider will still move over .050 in each direction. The fork doesn't move but the slider does. Does that make any more sense?

-Kuda

concrete guy
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#4

Post by concrete guy » Mon Oct 26, 2009 11:45 pm

When you say slider are you reallying meaning clutch? Sounds like you need new forks

Kuda
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#5

Post by Kuda » Tue Oct 27, 2009 1:22 pm

concrete guy wrote:When you say slider are you reallying meaning clutch? Sounds like you need new forks
OK, clutch then. As for the forks, I ordered a new set of Andrew's forks and mic'd both. They're the same size, so I don't think they're worn much if at all...

-Kuda

steinauge
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#6

Post by steinauge » Tue Oct 27, 2009 1:55 pm

I just went out in the shop and measured the fork to clutch clearance on a rev-wreck 4 speed and a Harley 4 speed.The rev-junk ran .018" and the H.D .024" .The check on the HD trans was made with a new OEM fork. are the nuts that hold the shift fork tight? If they are loose it will give you a LOT of slop when you try to set the clutches.

Kuda
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#7

Post by Kuda » Tue Oct 27, 2009 4:41 pm

steinauge wrote:I just went out in the shop and measured the fork to clutch clearance on a rev-wreck 4 speed and a Harley 4 speed.The rev-junk ran .018" and the H.D .024" .The check on the HD trans was made with a new OEM fork. are the nuts that hold the shift fork tight? If they are loose it will give you a LOT of slop when you try to set the clutches.
Wow, I'm really struggling to explain here. I wish I had one of my manuals right here with me so I could use the correct term. But yes, the nuts are tight, the fork doesn't move much if at all. It's what the fork *holds* (sliders? clutches?) that moves in both directions about .050. Does that make any more sense?

-Kud a

concrete guy
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#8

Post by concrete guy » Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:02 pm

If you can put your clutch tight to one side of the fork and measure .050", that seems like a lot from what he stated above about revies and OEM. How old are these old girls?

51Hog
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#9

Post by 51Hog » Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:09 pm

You must be talking about the gear with the 6 square teeth?

Kuda
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#10

Post by Kuda » Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:12 pm

51Hog wrote:You must be talking about the gear with the 6 square teeth?
Whew! Yes! That's it...

-Kuda

steinauge
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#11

Post by steinauge » Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:21 pm

Kuda I understood what you meant, those numbers were what I got between the shift fork and the shifter clutch on those two transmissions. The shifter clutch is what is moving back and forth.I dont know that I ever worried much about that movement if the fork and clutch were undamaged.Go ahead and set the trans up and just be certain that under NO circumstance will it engage two gears at once ,it should work fine.

Kuda
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#12

Post by Kuda » Tue Oct 27, 2009 6:07 pm

steinauge wrote:Kuda I understood what you meant, those numbers were what I got between the shift fork and the shifter clutch on those two transmissions. The shifter clutch is what is moving back and forth.I dont know that I ever worried much about that movement if the fork and clutch were undamaged.Go ahead and set the trans up and just be certain that under NO circumstance will it engage two gears at once ,it should work fine.
OK, that makes me feel a bit better. But I'm still not sure how to ensure that the distance between the clutch and the adjacent gear on both sides is equal, or, like another poster stated, *slightly* away from each other. I was trying to use a feeler gauge to check the distance between the clutch and the gears when I noticed that the damn thing moves so much that a feeler gauge is useless. Any thoughts? I may be over thinking this a bit but I'm gettin' REAL tired of pulling the trans outta this thing...

-Kuda

steinauge
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#13

Post by steinauge » Tue Oct 27, 2009 6:55 pm

I use the tool to center the shift clutch between the gears on either side of it.I want them centered when the shifter clutches are in the middle of their back and forth shake.HTH

NightShift
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...Sneak and Peak

#14

Post by NightShift » Tue Oct 27, 2009 7:13 pm

Alls ya gotta do is get the forks in the middle.

The spider gears float.

Put the lid on.
Shift it through its gears back to neutral.
Sneak the lid off slowly and peak at where it puts the forks.
Then shim the forks where they should be if it needs it.

Respectful,

steinauge
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Re: Aligning shift forks to top...

#15

Post by steinauge » Tue Oct 27, 2009 7:43 pm

Shifty hes got the tool and is confused enough already. He probably doesnt need to hear how we learned to do it. :wink: respectful,Kurt

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